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The Strategy of Greek Primacists

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Paul Younanmoderator

 
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The Strategy of Greek Primacists

Apr-04-2001 at 03:11 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

Shlama Akhay,

Here is the strategy that Greek Primacists use to repel any proof you may give them regarding Aramaic primacy:

Show them Semitic Poetry



  • "It's Dialogue that occured in Aramaic"
  • "It's source documents in Aramaic"
  • "Of course it's Semitic poetry, it's a Hebraic context"

Show them Semitic Word-plays



  • "It's Dialogue that occured in Aramaic"
  • "It's source documents in Aramaic"
  • "Of course it's Semitic Word-plays, it's a Hebraic context"


Show them obvious mistranslation because of spelling in the Aramaic



  • "It's source documents in Aramaic"

Show them obvious Aramaic idioms in the NARRATIVE



  • "It's an Aramaicism"
  • "It's imitation of the Septuagint"
  • "It's Koine Greek"

Show them obvious Aramaic idioms in the DIALOGUE


  • "It's Dialogue that occured in Aramaic"

    Show them where the story ONLY makes sense in Aramaic


  • "It's source-text integrity"


  • How can I argue against this?


    Fk^rwbw 0ml4

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    YesuahBarAlaha777
     
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    1. RE: The Strategy of Greek Primacists

    May-16-2001 at 03:38 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

    In reply to message #0
     
    my friend paul younan,to be maken the greeks be one with u,only tell them,is haldiki not aram?is aram not haldiki?are chaldeans not aram?same!!!greeks and arameans are same!!what greeks not agree is that arkadians aren't sumerians!!!and sumerians come out of arkadians,and arkadians aren't semits!!!but an old culture where all comeing out,like slavs greeks and others,but aramaic people come out of sumeric ,but they belong also to be one witch all of the world cause they arkadik to!!just know greeks are very old and also babylonians!!babylon whas lived with many people,babylon not belows only to one nation!!So we all are one.And we chose not to fight for who is older,but for who like to be one of all and all be one,not by a name,but by love!!!amun!!So all Nation in the name of ALAHA become one!!bye

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    Paul Younanmoderator

     
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    3. RE: The Strategy of Greek Primacists

    May-16-2001 at 07:16 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

    In reply to message #1
     
    Shlama Akhi,

    Please forgive my passion in this posting, it was posted quite some time ago, and in a certain context (a heated debate with a Greek Primacist) without which it is impossible to understand my intent.

    Of course, we are all one in Alaha and Maran Eshoa Mshikha, no matter what language we read His message in.

    May He guide us closer to Him, and may He heal the divisions which have separated all nations and creeds since the day of creation.

    I, for one, will try and focus on what unites, rather than divides, all of God's children. Akhi Savitr, thanks for pointing me in the right direction again.


    Fk^rwbw 0ml4

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    Savitri
     
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    4. On the Lighter Side. . . .

    May-17-2001 at 01:36 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

    In reply to message #3
     
    Shlama, Akhi Paul,

    Cool! And now that we've agreed not to be TOO contentious, I can't resist sharing a quote I just relocated (from Friedrich Nietzsche, of all people!). Hope you enjoy:

    "It is a curious thing that God learned Greek when He wished to turn author--and that he did not learn it better."

    Hey, there's always room for a little humour, right?

    Shlama w'Burkate,

    Savitr

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    Savitri
     
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    2. RE: The Strategy of Greek Primacists

    May-16-2001 at 05:26 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

    In reply to message #0
     
    Shlama, Akhi Paul

    Okay, confession time: I was once one of those Greek primacists. And why wouldn't I be? All of my theological training was from the perspective of Greek primacy, so if I wanted to take any pride in my academic accomplishments, I naturally had to defend the keystone that supported them.

    I remember the first time I was exposed to the writings of George Lamsa and Erico Rocco, and how my ego bristled even against the simple logic of their arguments.

    Later, however, I came across the work of Dr. Neil Douglas-Klotz. I know that some of you disagree with his interpretations, but I have to tell you that I was totally blown away by the beauty and expansive spirituality of the Aramaic texts as he revealed them in his books. When I realized by comparison how restrictive my own Greek translations were, I knew that I needed to open up to a spirituality and poetic grace that had been left out--not in the translation from Aramaic to Greek necessarily, but in the translation from a Semetic to a Western mind-set.

    Academic debate is "the way it's done" in most of our universities, but it's also true that it takes at least one generation for outmoded ideas to die out--simply due to the fact that new material must hit receptive ears before it can be taught; and it's the students, not the professors, who are more likely to be receptive.

    I would also ask you to acknowledge the possibility that we are all born with one goal in mind--to know God. Fully, infinitely, and eternally. If this is our desire, it is also the desire of every Greek primacist, and of everyone else we meet in our lives.

    I have found that there is a Love, a Unity, a relationship with God that is implicit in the Aramaic understandings of the Gospels that is missing in the Greek and other western interpretations. And yet, it is this bond that our hearts desire most of all.

    So, Akhi Paul, I would simply answer your question thus: Give your "opponents" exactly what they've been looking for. Not the academic arguments that can be battled by intellect and ego, but the sheer beauty and spiritual expansiveness of the Aramaic language and the Aramaic gospels.

    We are not fighting a battle here; we all want the same thing, in an ultimate sense. So my advice is to give your "opponents" their hearts' desire. At least, it grabbed me, and many others who've enjoyed listening to me since. There may be tougher nuts to crack than myself, but you have a phenomenal gift to share from your knowledge of Aramaic--and if you choose to share in Love and communion, how can you possibly go wrong?

    Shlama w'Burkate,

    Savitr

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    Assyria \ã-'sir-é-ä\ n (1998)   1:  an ancient empire of Ashur   2:  a democratic state in Bet-Nahren, Assyria (northern Iraq, northwestern Iran, southeastern Turkey and eastern Syria.)   3:  a democratic state that fosters the social and political rights to all of its inhabitants irrespective of their religion, race, or gender   4:  a democratic state that believes in the freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture in faithfulness to the principles of the United Nations Charter — Atour synonym

    Ethnicity, Religion, Language
    » Israeli, Jewish, Hebrew
    » Assyrian, Christian, Aramaic
    » Saudi Arabian, Muslim, Arabic
    Assyrian \ã-'sir-é-an\ adj or n (1998)   1:  descendants of the ancient empire of Ashur   2:  the Assyrians, although representing but one single nation as the direct heirs of the ancient Assyrian Empire, are now doctrinally divided, inter sese, into five principle ecclesiastically designated religious sects with their corresponding hierarchies and distinct church governments, namely, Church of the East, Chaldean, Maronite, Syriac Orthodox and Syriac Catholic.  These formal divisions had their origin in the 5th century of the Christian Era.  No one can coherently understand the Assyrians as a whole until he can distinguish that which is religion or church from that which is nation -- a matter which is particularly difficult for the people from the western world to understand; for in the East, by force of circumstances beyond their control, religion has been made, from time immemorial, virtually into a criterion of nationality.   3:  the Assyrians have been referred to as Aramaean, Aramaye, Ashuraya, Ashureen, Ashuri, Ashuroyo, Assyrio-Chaldean, Aturaya, Chaldean, Chaldo, ChaldoAssyrian, ChaldoAssyrio, Jacobite, Kaldany, Kaldu, Kasdu, Malabar, Maronite, Maronaya, Nestorian, Nestornaye, Oromoye, Suraya, Syriac, Syrian, Syriani, Suryoye, Suryoyo and Telkeffee. — Assyrianism verb

    Aramaic \ar-é-'máik\ n (1998)   1:  a Semitic language which became the lingua franca of the Middle East during the ancient Assyrian empire.   2:  has been referred to as Neo-Aramaic, Neo-Syriac, Classical Syriac, Syriac, Suryoyo, Swadaya and Turoyo.

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