I understand that many Aramaic words used by Jesus were not gender specific, and only when the later Greek and English translations came into existence under the patriarchal church authorities did the male usage become dominant. So I am wondering whether specific usage of the male in the interlinear Peshitta translations is real or a continuing reflection of convention? For example in Matthew I see the frequent usage of "sons of man", which became "men" in the KJV etc, although "others" in another version that I do not know what it is. Does the Aramaic specifically use 'sons' and 'man' in those contexts such as Matthew 5:16? The whole question of the distinction between male and female, whether it was made by Jesus, is becoming increasingly topical I believe. Neil Douglas Klotz in "Prayers of the Cosmos" seems to suggest that in many areas a specific gender is not indicated in the Aramaic words. Would be interested in your comments. Thanks With the blessings of the Father/Mother Chris L
I'm not sure about the rest of your question, but let me say this much. All Aramaic words MUST have gender! There are no exceptions to this-- the neuter state ("it") does not exist in any Semitic languages, which would also include Hebrew and Arabic.
There are a few irregular cases where inherently masculine words ("fathers") have endings on them that would normally be feminine, but that is a whole other issue.
"sons of man" is masculine in Matti 5:16-- but if you want to see an interesting way that Aramaic turns gender on its head as opposed to Greek, check out the interlinear of Yukhanan 21:15-17 and compare it to any other version and be amazed.
Thanks Andrew. I have responded to Pauls confirmation of your clear answer with a little more behind the reason for my question, which I wanted to trace back to the source, in the Aramaic to clear up my uncertainty over the use of the Father/Mother term for God, ascribing equivalence to the two genders. Thanks again to you both. Chris L
The words 0rb (#3190, singular) and Ynb (#3230, plural) are both masculine and refer to 'offspring.'
The feminine equivalents would be trb (#3315, singular) and tnb (#3312, plural.)
As Akhi Andrew has stated, it is in fact the opposite of what Neil Douglas Klotz claims. There is no such thing as neuter in Aramaic.
This becomes interesting in that the Holy Spirit is feminine in Aramaic, and this is in fact how the early Church and many of our early patristic writing refers to "it." (cf. The Odes of Solomon)
Right or wrong, this has changed over time, due to male dominance - as you have suggested - even in the Aramaic-based churches.
Many thanks to you Paul and Andrew for making that so simply clear, and removing the apparently misguided evidence. How does someone like myself with no direct knowledge of the aramaic know that "Holy Spirit" is feminine? And following the theme behind my question, where some organisations refer to God as the Father/Mother duality, is the Aramaic word "Allahah" (excuse my spelling) that I understand became 'Good' and via the German 'Gut' became the English 'God' masculine only? And if so did Jesus refer to a female aspect in anyway through his Aramaic tongue?
You're absolutely correct in that someone with no direct knowledge of Aramaic (yet! ) would not know whether a claim like that is true or not, nor would they realize that every time Christ said "Holy Spirit" his hearers would have understood a feminine aspect of the Godhead. But you are asking questions and inquiring (hopefully soon studying) and that's how you'll know for yourself.
This sounds strange to most, but that's really how the Holy Spirit was viewed even by the early Aramaic-based Church (as a feminine aspect of the Godhead.) For a real eye-opener, please check out this post (especially Ode 19): https://www.atour.com/forums/peshitta/395.html and also this video (comments near the end):
Now, in reality and physically, God is neither male nor female - but certain attributes are described in human terms (masculine and feminine) that give us insight into - and familiarity with - His Being.
Any human formula is incomplete, of course. But with Aramaic, we do come a little bit closer to the psyche of those first band of Galileans who followed Him - those who wrote the original material known to the West through it's translation from Aramaic (oral or written) into Greek.
What proof do you have that God is neither male nor female, because as I understand it He would be male otherwise why did He say "let us make man in our image" and first made adam. And when He took the form of man (Jesus) why did He come down as a man and not a woman.
By the "image of God" the Church has traditionally understood that mankind (both sexes) was created with free will and intelligence.
What I meant by my statement is this -
God is Spirit, not flesh. By saying "man" I am referring to a creature and not the Creator - a creature with one X and one Y chromosome, as opposed to "female" with 2 X chromosomes.
Spirit does not have chromosomes, not to mention other physical features which differentiate the human sexes. (c.f. - Matthew 22:30)
Of course Maran Mshikha, in his human qnoma ("essence") was materially "male" (physically speaking.)
God has traditionally been given male attributes because of the ideas associated with most of them - (like strength.)
But in our tradition God has also been given "female" attributes.
As I said, though - these are inadequate expressions of human understanding that can never come close to describing the ineffable. God is neither male nor female, but Spirit, Truth and Love.
Shlama Akhi Paul Thank you for your responses. I know you are right. There are many 'synonyms' for God, such as 'Spirit, Truth and Love', none of which have any physical attributes. It is so easy to fall into the trap of thinking that as we were made in the "image of God" then God in some way must look like our physical form. Our physical appearence is not the real us either. We too are spiritual beings - body, mind and soul. Take all the physical matter, which is only in the nuclei of all the atoms we are composed of, if that (!?), of the bodies of all the 6 billion people on earth, combine it together and it would only be the size of a pea!! We are mostly 'space' as Dean Portinga has pointed out in "Spiritual Insights", termed by some as "the field of intelligence", for others perhaps all the energies of mind, soul and spirit. Shlama w'burkate Chris Laughton PS Thanks Paul for those two website references
Assyria
\ã-'sir-é-ä\ n (1998)
1: an ancient empire of Ashur
2: a democratic state in Bet-Nahren, Assyria (northern
Iraq, northwestern Iran, southeastern Turkey and eastern Syria.)
3:
a democratic state that fosters the social and political rights to all of
its inhabitants irrespective of their religion, race, or gender
4: a democratic state that believes in the freedom of
religion, conscience, language, education and culture in faithfulness to the
principles of the United Nations Charter —
Atour synonym
Ethnicity, Religion, Language
»
Israeli, Jewish, Hebrew
»
Assyrian, Christian, Aramaic
»
Saudi Arabian, Muslim, Arabic
Assyrian
\ã-'sir-é-an\ adj or n (1998)
1: descendants of the ancient empire of Ashur
2: the Assyrians, although representing but one single
nation as the direct heirs of the ancient Assyrian Empire, are now
doctrinally divided, inter sese, into five principle
ecclesiastically designated religious sects with their corresponding
hierarchies and distinct church governments, namely, Church of the
East, Chaldean, Maronite, Syriac Orthodox and Syriac Catholic.
These formal divisions had their origin in the 5th century of the
Christian Era. No one can coherently understand the Assyrians
as a whole until he can distinguish that which is religion or church
from that which is nation -- a matter which is particularly
difficult for the people from the western world to understand; for
in the East, by force of circumstances beyond their control,
religion has been made, from time immemorial, virtually into a
criterion of nationality.
3:
the Assyrians have been referred to as Aramaean, Aramaye, Ashuraya,
Ashureen, Ashuri, Ashuroyo, Assyrio-Chaldean, Aturaya, Chaldean,
Chaldo, ChaldoAssyrian, ChaldoAssyrio, Jacobite, Kaldany, Kaldu,
Kasdu, Malabar, Maronite, Maronaya, Nestorian, Nestornaye, Oromoye,
Suraya, Syriac, Syrian, Syriani, Suryoye, Suryoyo and Telkeffee. —
Assyrianism verb
Aramaic
\ar-é-'máik\
n (1998)
1: a Semitic language which became the lingua franca of
the Middle East during the ancient Assyrian empire.
2: has been referred to as Neo-Aramaic, Neo-Syriac, Classical
Syriac, Syriac, Suryoyo, Swadaya and Turoyo.
, Jun-18-2001 at 10:44 AM, (2)
) would not know whether a claim like that is true or not, nor would they realize that every time Christ said "Holy Spirit" his hearers would have understood a feminine aspect of the Godhead. But you are asking questions and inquiring (hopefully soon studying) and that's how you'll know for yourself.