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2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

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Larry19
 
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2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Nov-25-2001 at 09:09 AM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

Shlama to all,

Here's a couple of verses (consecutive, I might add) that could be translated better. Dr. George M. Lamsa has them in a chapter entitled "How to Ascertain an Original"
fmt4m-Meshtamlena,"will be through," in Luke 13:32, is rendered teleioumai-Teleioumai,"will be perfected."
rw9s0-Esaor,"to work" (spiritual work),in Luke 13:33 (the very next verse),is translated Poreuesqai-Poreuesthai,"to walk." The Eastern text reads "But, I must do my work today and tomorrow."

Shlama w'Burkate,

Ysl9k cn9rt tr9blg rb dnwmyr cn9rwl
Lawrence Raymond Kelsey

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Paul Younanmoderator

 
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1. RE: 2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Nov-26-2001 at 05:25 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #0
 
Shlama Akhi Lawrence,

OK - now for the hard part () - how and why did the Greek translator of the Aramaic text of Luke make those 2 mistakes?

Answer in 48 hours if nobody else takes a shot at it.... (tick-tock, tick-tock, ....)

Fk^rwbw 0ml4

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3. RE: 2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Dec-01-2001 at 08:44 AM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #1
 
Shlama Akhi Paul,

Could the word the Greeks mistook for rw9s0 -"work" be 0krw0 which is the lexeme of #1755-0krw0bd (that means "journeying")? This is the best I could do so far on the Luke 13:33 "goof".
Is the "db" a "double proclitic"? Would #1755 be (ultra-literally "of-at-length")?

Shlama w'Burkate,

Lawrence Raymond Kelsey

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7. Answer #2

Dec-03-2001 at 03:53 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #3
 
Shlama Akhi Lawrence,

This one is a killer but try and follow my (hopefully not too) confusing explanation.

The Aramaic verbal root r9s means many things, including, but not limited, to:


  1. Visit, Travel
  2. Do (work)
  3. Effect

Here are some Nouns that are derived from this root (and the reason of derivation


  • Bishop (0rw9s from #1 above, because a Bishop travels and visits his parishes. Example: Keepa 2:25)
  • Matter, Affair, Business (0nr9ws from #2 above, because a matter or affair or business is "done." Example: 1Thessalonians 4:11)
  • Action (0nr9ws from #3 above, because a an "action" is "effected." Example: Luke 23:51)

So let's come back to the word in question, rw9s0 - our friend Zorba () ran across this word and correctly identified the root as r9s

Realizing that he just translated that same root in Luke 1:68, correctly, as "visit" - he thought to himself, erroneously, "The Lord Jesus is talking about visiting and walking about, just like my Bishop does."

But Mshikha was talking about the need to do his work today and tomorrow, not about his walking schedule.

And so we have yet another distortion of Mshikha's words in the Greek translation - the 'Best Greek' of the New Testament, so we are told.

Fk^rwbw 0ml4

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Andrew Gabriel Roth
 
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2. RE: 2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Nov-26-2001 at 06:17 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #0
 
Last edited by Andrew Gabriel Roth on Nov-26-2001 at 06:23 PM (CT)

>Shlama to all,
>
>Here's a couple of verses (consecutive,
>I might add) that could
>be translated better. Dr. George
>M. Lamsa has them in
>a chapter entitled "How to
>Ascertain an Original"
> fmt4m-Meshtamlena,"will be
>through," in Luke 13:32, is
>rendered teleioumai-Teleioumai,"will be perfected."

SHLAMA ALL--

I'LL TAKE THE FIRST ONE AND LEAVE THE OTHER TO SOMEONE ELSE. "MESHTAMELENA" (WILL BE THROUGH) IS MISTAKEN FOR "MESHEMALAYA" (#11858 MEM-SHIN-MEM-LAMED-YODH-ALAP), WHICH MEANS "PERFECTED", AND THIS IS WHAT IS TRANSLATED INTO GREEK. ANOTHER FORM OF THE WORD (#11864) IS THE SINGLE EMPHATIC FEMINIE FORM THAT APPEARS IN MARK 4:38 AND IS SPELLED:

MEM-SHIN-MEM-LAMED-YODH-TAW-ALAP (THE "TA" BEING THE FEMININE ENDING).

THE GREEK TRANSLATOR OBVIOUSLY JUMPED THE GUN HERE BECAUSE HE THOUGHT HE WAS SEEING THE ROOT "SHLAMA" WHICH MEANS "PEACE" BUT ALSO "PERFECTION", SUCH AS "M'SHALAM" ("IT IS ACCOMPLISHED"). I SUSPECT THAT THE NUN WAS MISTAKEN FOR A YODH BECAUSE WHEN JOINED THEY CAN LOOK A LOT ALIKE, AND OUR FRIEND ZORBA WAS ALSO IN A HURRY BECAUSE IN HIS MIND HE TRANSPOSED THE POSITION OF THE TAW FROM AFTER THE SHIN TO AFTER THE YODH-AS-NUN. TSK TSK. BEWARE GREEKS BEARING BOOKS.

SHLAMA W'BURKATE
ANDREW GABRIEL ROTH
>
> rw9s0-Esaor,"to work"
>(spiritual work),in Luke 13:33 (the
>very next verse),is translated >face="symbol"size="4"]Poreuesqai-Poreuesthai,"to walk." The Eastern text
>reads "But, I must do
>my work today and tomorrow."
>
>
>Shlama w'Burkate,
>
>Ysl9k cn9rt tr9blg rb
>dnwmyr cn9rwl

>Lawrence Raymond Kelsey


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6. Nailed problem #1.

Dec-03-2001 at 02:57 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #2
 
Shlama Akhi Andrew,

Yup - that's what happened, exactly. Couldn't have demonstrated it better. And Luke is supposedly 'the best Greek in the New Testament.'

Fk^rwbw 0ml4

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4. RE: 2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Dec-03-2001 at 02:42 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #0
 
Hello dear All,

please, explan me (to a serious researcher who don't understand english ) what is the difference "will be through" and "shall be perfected" ? My dictionary tell me for both word: to accomplish, done, complete, finish.

The second goof is very good and clear! But my opinion the "walking" does not modify seriously the meaning of the verse, the prophets walked always a lot...

cheers,
Gabor

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5. RE: 2 goofs in a row in Luke 13

Dec-03-2001 at 02:42 PM (UTC+3 Nineveh, Assyria)

In reply to message #0
 
Dear Akhi Paul! Please help!

I tried to find the word "to work" what Larry mentioned in the Syriac Dictionary. I found the first three letters 9s0 but no more. I'm on page 23-24, it is already "warm" or I'm totally lost??? Estrangelo is more better....


thanks,
Gabor

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